What Means Are Available To Resume a Path Toward Israeli-Palestinian Peace?

Posted by DipNote Bloggers
December 30, 2008
Israeli Missle Attack in Gaza

DipNote Editors' Note: Due to ongoing events in the Middle East, this entry will remain the "Question of the Week" for two weeks.

Although conflict between Israel and Hamas continues, polls conducted prior to the recent violence indicated that majorities of both Palestinians and Israelis favored a peaceful, negotiated solution to their differences.

What possible means are readily available to resume a path toward peace between Israel and Palestine?

Comments

Comments

Joe
|
Tennessee, USA
January 3, 2009

Joe in Tennessee writes:

Don't you think you might be giving Hamas a little too much credit for having the required intellectual capacity to be defined as evil?

You have answered your own question: If I honestly care about my Peoples welfare, how intelligent is it to put them in harms way vs. building infrastructure from newly given natural resources; especially given the fact no matter what is done internationally, it will be more than a decade for oil not to have a major impact on all developed societies?

They are simply trying to establish a separate Palestine for that exact purpose down the line which is adverse to all democratic ideologies and personal freedoms. They are EVIL in every respect sir, from methodology and ideology to resource obtainment only to gather for weapons and not peace or development.

The shame is, the more air time they get, the more empowerment they receive globally.

I suggest you all study the history of Hamas and realize that you who are here able to write what you believe would not under their rule. Why would you mandate that on anyone else? They are not a flexible theology, nor honorable to their word. They only use cease fires to rebuild arsenals which are channeled in from Syria and Iran. They have proven their intents repeatedly for decades now. Who among you would want to live in their political state or religious state ...as well as mandate your children to do so? If not, why defend them?...because your free to do so...

Zharkov
|
United States
January 3, 2009

Zharkov in U.S.A. writes:

One thing is crystal clear - the path to peace in the Middle East does not begin in America. We have tried without success for over 60 years to resolve this problem and it is insane to continue to believe it will be somehow magically be solved on this side of the world.

Israel was initially populated with European Jews fleeing Nazi Germany. Some on this blog may be surprised to learn that America did not commit the Holocaust and was not the colonial power in control of Palestine before 1948. Hitler was not elected president in America, much to the disappointment of Wall Street, and we have no guilt for what he did to the Jews.

The weight of the Israeli-Palestinian problem rests on Europe, not America. We, as the great intermeddlers that we are, have failed to resolve anything.

It is up to Israel and it's Arab neighbors to settle their problems, not us, and they are big, wealthy nations populated by adults who can made decisions for themselves without our help. Let's allow them the chance to do so.

Henry
|
Florida, USA
January 3, 2009

Henry in Florida writes:

Just stop that Israeli agression now.

Donald
|
Virginia, USA
January 3, 2009

Donald in Virginia writes:

I don't think anyone wants to see innocent people being destroyed on earth. We all know who launched the intial attacks into Isreal. A day when people can live without trying to destroy mankind will be a good day. Everyone in the world has the right to Defend themselves in harms way.

A power struggle between people. Over land or over religon?

The war between the Jews and Arabs is Biblical.

The bottom line is we all should all pray for a Peaceful solution and hope that an agreement will be signed and adhered to in present and future.

Enough bloodshed in the Middle East!!!

I just think all the money, time and politics placed on these two has been in vein.

Why can't everyone just get along in the world without having to destroy each other? Why can't Jews and Arabs accept they are different and have unique views without having to lead to war. The both have very strong ties to religon and yet in the years on earth they continue to hate each other with a passion.

The problem I see it's a group of people who do not want Peace and will only cause more hate, more destruction, more acts of terrorism and put more innocent people in the path of war or death.

The entire Middle East is a boiling point. This message should be about how people on earth can stop or end the violence and communicate as adults. We Americans have seen firsthand, time and time again how only a group of people want to make names for themselves and its all for nothing.

Terrorism is just plain evil. The change that needs to come about is how all Arab States can offer solutions as well about the people who conduct these acts of terrorism. Kings and Prime Ministers should be involved to prevent these kinds of attacks.

"The United Nations should be involved bringing resolve to this present conflict. The Arab League should also be present to offer its suggestions to bring peace. When Israel, and all Arab States can agree on Peace and educate the people to prevent this from ever happening again, then and only Then their will be Peace between them."

When everyone can read from the same sheet of music and dance the night away in Peace, Victory Happens on both sides. When people can learn to live with each other and not fight then we all can celebrate happiness and live another day! As so as it is written.

Godbless and pray for Peace for mankind.

Zharkov
|
United States
January 4, 2009

Zharkov in U.S.A. writes:

The internet is flooded with the accusation that Hamas attacked Israel first, but for some strange reason, the news media never mentions WHY Hamas fired the rockets.

Do we really know who violated the cease fire first?

Can we believe ANYTHING about what we are told of this war?

Palestinians claim that part of the cease fire agreement was to be the lifting of the Gaza blockade by Israel. The cease fire became effective but the blockade was not lifed as the Palestinians had expected, and they accuse Israel of violating the cease fire.

Israel claims to have undertaken to ease its blockade of the enclave, but Israeli spokesman Mark Regev said before the ceasefire went into effect that it would be a "staged process.""When calm is established, other matters will follow, including the liberation of the sanction regime," he said. Palestinians say this never happened as promised.

When Al-Hayat asked him why rockets were still be fired from the Hamas-controlled Gaza against Israel in violation of the ceasefire accord, Abu Marsuk said the rockets were not fired by Hamas members.

He accused Mohammed Dahlan, a deputy of the rival Fatah organisation and former head of the Palestinian security service, of being behind the latest attacks.

Both Fatah's military wing and the radical Islamic Jihad organization have taken responsibility for different rocket launchings since the ceasefire.

So what do we know for sure about this war?

Not much, I think.

Sam1
|
Illinois, USA
January 4, 2009

Sam writes:

Israel could not have picked a better time to launch this offensive. The Diplomatic clout of the current administration is all but exhausted. In the past four years has there been a single foreign policy success story? Has any US lead Diplomatic initiative yielded fruit? Annapolis, Pakistan, Somalia, South American, Darfur and North Korea have all been horrific failures! I would love to see the GAO numbers for all the Secretary's travels to the Middle East. One would think that something positive should have occurred from all that shuttle diplomacy. Quick question, what do the crewmembers of the Sirius Star and the residence of Gaza have in common? Answer; they have been shamelessly abandoned by the international community! The British FCO could care less about insurance rates going up for cargo shippers. Somali pirates threaten shipping and Lloyds of London profits skyrocket! The White House, State Department, AIPAC and CUFI support this invasion of Gaza 100%. Who helps the people of Gaza? No one! The Israelis will be assisted by members of the Joshua Fund. Tonight the Security Council will convene; some members will be recalled and paid time and a half to attend the meeting. Others will probably attend via conference call from upscale town houses in Manhattan. The attack will be condemned but the bombs will still fall. Phone calls will be made to leaders overseas but nothing will be accomplished to stop the suffering/killing. Since Hamas members are Shia Muslims instead of Sunni, their brother will betray them as well. The extent of Sunni support will be lip service and demonstrations outside Israeli Embassies in foreign capitals. Shameless, utterly shameless.

Susan
|
Florida, USA
January 4, 2009

Susan in Florida writes:

All the comments that have been written so far have missed the point. The bottom line is this...Hamas, and the Arab nations, have one goal and that goal is to destroy Israel. They have "stated" this on more than one occasion. There will be no peace in the Middle East because "peace" has never been the objective. The goal, for centuries, has always been the same. The elimination of the Jews, period. And on this I do agree with Donald in Virginia, it is Biblical. Mankind will not solve this situation.

Peter
|
California, USA
January 4, 2009

Peter in California writes:

These are the requirements for any peaceful settlement:

1. Recognition of each others' state's and government's right to exist.

2. A determination of whether Gaza will be independent of, or part of, the Palestinian Authority. To be determined by a referendum within Gaza and Palestine, to be certified by independent international monitors.

3. A recognition of prior agreements and concords, such as the Wye River Memorandum, Camp David 2000 Summit, Beirut Summit, etc.

4. A significant return to negotiations regarding the 2003 "Road Map" for peace.

5. Financial Stimulus for both parties for peace. Tie international aid and investment to peace and accord. While permitting certain forms of humanitarian and basic economic support (food, fuel, etc.), have the US, EU, and other top 20 economies tie more advanced forms of finance and economic development to Israel and Palestine based upon specific curtailments of violence by their own societies. If there was profit to be found in peace, more people would choose it. Terrorists, militants and pro-conflict zealots would then lose popular support by alienating the rest of the world and making their own people suffer. Moderates would then be incented to calm radicals and extremists in their populations. Put some billions into peace, and see who responds. Pay only a little up-front as incentives and as "seed capital" for programs. Then ramp up payments and investment as people prove they can indeed manage their own societies.

6. Work towards border openings and diplomatic relations for Gaza based on management of violence and corruption.

7. Try to elevate the Geneva Accord back to the table, and find out what specific objections there are towards it in both Palestinian and Israeli circles. Find the specific objections, and see what can be done to produce a gap-analysis compromise settlement. Phase in compliance to a permanent settlement over time based on conformance of both parties.

8. If need be, consider authorizing an international peacekeeping force of up to 10,000 to go between Israel and Gaza, and to patrol Gaza. Have it comprised of members of Islamic states to prevent issues of non-Islamic military being present. Give them the right to police the Gaza strip, including shoot-to-kill orders for people who set up rockets to kill civilians in Israel. Ensure neutral nations provide logistics, accounting, and judiciary/military police to prevent collusion and/or illicit arms shipments coming in to fuel Gaza militant groups clandestinely.

sam
|
Illinois, USA
January 5, 2009

Sam writes:

Donald and Susan say this is a Biblical problem. There is no problem with the Bible, the problems are with people. What scriptures offer a road map to peace in the Torah, New Testament or the Koran? Years ago I was attending a Church in San Antonio. I was told that peace could be obtained in the Middle East if certain scriptures were adhered to. I forget which passages were used but they were from the Hebrew Scriptures (Torah/Old Testament), a major or minor prophet. Do unto others as you would have others do unto you should be the strategy implemented by both sides in this conflict. That should settle the issue. Just little things at first like, if you don't bomb our children we won't bomb yours. But one has to be really careful when using scriptures to justify military intervention. Let's not forget that it was the evangelical right wing of the Republican Party that got us here. The PNAC's, the AEI's, the Heritage Foundations, think tanks, beltway bandits, contractors, NEOCONS, Vulcan's and special program groups all mislead the American people and the international community. America needed to respond to 911 but did we not learn anything from the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan? If the sole reason for invading Iraq was to change the dynamic in the Middle East then we were successful! Hamas, Hezbollah and Tehran will be eternally grateful that we removed there stumbling blocks for them. Everyone has a book, the Iranians will hold up the Koran and thank GOD when oil prices go up and Western economies suffer. The Israelis will use the Torah as a property deed of sorts. The American ecclesiastical community will use a scripture like Genesis 12:3 to justify total support for Israel. Books like the late great planet earth, End of Days and Epicenter will fill the shelves of book stores and polarize millions. Knowledge is out there but not wisdom, (the application of knowledge). Information but no revelation as I hear it said on wednesday/friday nights and sunday mornings. When I lived in Texas it was easier for me to side with Israel on every issue. I did not live next to Muslims. In Addis Ababa my neighbors were Muslims. Now I listen to an issue before making a discussion. Back to my PMBOK!! PS: The Sunday read section of the Washington Times contains some very interesting reading. I can hear Jack Sparrow saying, "bloody pirates mate." U.S. mission to the African Union has another success story.

Jane
|
Australia
January 5, 2009

Jane in Australia writes:

As with Sinn Fein and the IRA, who lay down the battle and were willing to negotiate was there any possible hope of rational peace.

Till the respective leaders do so and lead by example and be willing to concede to peaceful negotiation there can be no peace. The breaking of the truce is irrelevant, which side provoked first is childish and ignorant.

Can always hope for the new generation to prove that the elders that lead them to war, have only their selfish interests at heart.

Negotiation, compromise, education, respect. Words yes but both sides of the fence do deserve a better way of life.

Donald
|
Virginia, USA
January 5, 2009

Donald in Virginia writes:

5 January 09

@ Jane in Australia -- I don't think it's childesh that someone launches missiles at anyone? I agree with Susan from Florida that Hamas has said it many times, they would destroy Isreal given the chance. They would fight to the last breath, for what I have no idea.

It's not ignorant or childesh, it's self preservation. I have seen over the years how Isreal had made many steps towards peace and offered many things to these groups to bring about peace. "Give someone a foot, they take a yard" well Hamas has bad blood. I don't think its the people of Hamas, it's the terrorist within them that have put the safety of all people in the firing line.

Now what is childesh is when people cannot communicate and work out their problems and it does lead to war. Education is a powerful tool. People of both sides need to be educated to prevent future wars. They need training on how to Love thy Neighbor, not build weapons to destroy thy neighbor!

"Maybe both sides needs a shipment of Viagra and with a big Happy Face on the box"? It's quite possible that both sides needs more love than war!

@ Sam -- I can agree with most of your views as well. United States has made some mistakes over the years. How we blamed Iraq for what happened with 9/11 is beyond me. I always thought it was Usama Bin Laden's group responsible for the World Trade Center and the Pentagon attacks.

It all boils down to People. If the people can learn to get along in life and live together. You can have many settlements but if the people will not face each other, talk to each other, and go to school with each other, than they will only continue to hate each other. The turnaround process needs to happen and remove the hate and plant new seeds of hope and pray that both sides can end the violence. They both need to finally accept one another on earth as a person, show respect for one another, be nice to one other and live peaceful with one another.

I pray for Peace, that all people can work out their problems verbally. Communications is a wonderful tool when used properly. We all should pray for Peace. A Ceasefire, end of attacks on both sides. ABOVE ALL HOW DO WE PREVENT THIS FROM EVER HAPPENING AGAIN? REMOVE THE HATE THAT BOILS THE BLOOD AND PLANT NEW SEEDS! BRING ABOUT MORE HAPPY FACES :)

Zharkov
|
United States
January 5, 2009

Zharkov in U.S.A. writes:

The longer term objective of the Israeli war plan, as formulated by Israeli policy makers, is the expulsion of Palestinians from Palestinian lands:

"Terrorize the civilian population, assuring maximal destruction of property and cultural resources? The daily life of the Palestinians must be rendered unbearable: They should be locked up in cities and towns, prevented from exercising normal economic life, cut off from workplaces, schools and hospitals, This will encourage emigration and weaken the resistance to future expulsions" Ur Shlonsky, quoted by Ghali Hassan, Gaza: The World's Largest Prison, Global Research, 2005)

Operation "Cast Lead" is part of the broader military-intelligence operation initiated at the outset of the Ariel Sharon government in 2001. It was under Sharon's "Operation Justified Vengeance" that F-16 fighter planes were initially used to bomb Palestinian cities.

JOE
|
Tennessee, USA
January 5, 2009

Joe in Tennessee writes:

1. What is being overlooked greatly here is the acceptance of the Palestine people to accept accountability of their people; that means all their civilian population. They do not because they cannot and are under direct threat from this element, which means, in effect, there is no solvent leadership.

2. If we had a radical element or segment of population here in America, or in most civilized populations, who decided to send rockets into Canada, what do you think our Governmental position would be? Would we say: OK, let us talk to these guys and get things straightened out! Then say, OK they will stop for a while and then when they proceed again, do the same? That is not even realistic valuation in thinking.

a. Do you honestly think there is anyone has the right to terrorize another nation?

b. Do you think the Government of that nation has a responsibility to control this population element?

c. If the Government of the nation terrorizing another does nothing, or is unable to prevent cross border conflict, is it not the right of the Nation being terrorized to react?

3. It is obvious that the intent, if there is one beyond the ideological conflict by Hamas, is to form a separate Palestinian state which is under total control of this minority. I presume they are doing so with the help of a third and possibly fourth party. They have had talks with both Iran and Syria to install a future Navy base there and why?

4. Economics, there is an abundance of oil reserves both on the strip and offshore and Hamas wants total control of that element. If this was not the case they would have worked toward development of the resources for their people.

I am amazed that given the fact NOT ONE NEWSPAPER, Not one American I know of, nor one Leader in the free world would condone the theology and actions of Hamas, much less actually live under the law as they present it would not help in eliminating Hamas, not help them.

The Palestine people have a responsibility to their neighbors as well as the to and by the Palistine Government and they have proven without reservation they will not help, will not stop, will not turn in the people responsible and have no remorse for the Jewish State and innocent peoples they have killed in the last forty years. Hamas wants Israel to invade them and to be honest; I would not put it past them to kill their own citizens just to make Israel look bad.

They have left Israel no choice. Israel has done all it could, including the ejection of their own citizens on land they did not have to give back.

Israel has proven their peaceful nature and intent as well as bending over diplomatically from world presure; Palestine has shown and proven their intent and path.

J M.
|
Georgia, USA
January 5, 2009

JM in Georgia writes:

If there are 1.5million people living in an area about 25 miles long, how can anyone expect the military and extremists of Hamas not to operate in areas surrounded by civillians? Civilians are everywhere. The responses that they are using civilians as shields and Hamas is responsible for the deaths caused by isreals missles and tanks is ridiculous propoganda. It is a much more speedy victory to political power if you are willing to anhiliate your enemies. Isreal's government officials are just too politically afraid to give up what is necessary to negotiate fairly with the Palestinians. The people of Palestine are still human beings no matter how inconsequential Isreal, Bush and Rice make their lives out to be. Unbelievably, Israel seems to have missed the lessons from the Nazis that all human life is special and worth saving. If you live by the sword you'll die by it. Israel must face the fact that their country is not the same nation from the Bible, and that they obtained their country through illegitimate means.

J M.
|
Georgia, USA
January 5, 2009

JM in Georgia writes:

Joe from Tennessee says, "I am amazed that given the fact NOT ONE NEWSPAPER, Not one American I know of, nor one Leader in the free world would condone the theology and actions of Hamas,..."

Well first its nice to meet you, but from ATL, GA it looks like the Palestian people have adopted the ideology of our founding fathers of liberty or death. If the Palestinians are prisoners in their own country, and can't elect their own government, or participate in their own governance how are they free? If their children are killed with no one being brought to justice are they free?

Do you honestly think if Canada was controlling America and creating a situation similar to the one in GAZA that Americans would just peacfully negotiate for decades?

sam
|
Illinois, USA
January 7, 2009

Sam writes:

No peace in sight for those who live in Gaza, just the sounds of gunfire, rockets and Israeli jeeps blasting Matisyahu! Sooner or later President Obama will have to choose a special envoy to the Middle East. If Benjamin Netanyahu wins the election in February the choice should be quite simple; Connecticut's Senator Joe Lieberman. Who else would be so perfectly suited for the one sidedness of the assignment? He's also an independent; the perfect bipartisan selection! In 2007 I attended CUFI's night to honor Israel at the Washington Convention Center. It was a very impressive event. I hope someone has installed secure voice and email terminals at John Hagee's residence. It appears as if GOD has put him in a position where he knows a lot of very important individuals in Israel.

Zharkov
|
United States
January 6, 2009

Zharkov in U.S.A. writes:

It is shameful that the U.S. government has not maintained neutrality in this dispute, and now even goes so far as to be lying (again) about who started a war -- the same as it did during the Georga-Russia war.

The fact is, there are two sides to this story and we are only being told about one of them -- the Israeli side.

We may never be told by our own government what Israel did or did not do to break the ceasefire agreement.

We are never told WHY rockets were fired at Israel after the brief period of peace.

Why does our government always repeat Israeli propaganda when Israel's own news media often contradicts that?

Every ceasefire agreement places obligations on each side. Every such agreement requires each party to do, or refrain from doing, something. What, exactly, was Israel supposed to do during the cease fire? What was the Israeli obligation and how did they carry that out? If we listen only to our U.S. government, we would never know.

Jordan
|
South Dakota, USA
January 7, 2009

Jordan in South Dakota writes:

I think that Israel's actions in Operation Cast Lead are wholly justifiable. Just in the time frame of the inception of Operation Cast Lead, Israel has been bombarded with 325 rockets, 122 mortar rounds, and the use of I.E.D.s.

Hamas was formed in 1987 from the Muslim Brotherhood. "Harakat Al-Muqawama Al-Islamia," or Hamas, is just another fundamental Islamic Resistance Movement which is bound on the ideology of destroying Israel. From their inception as an organization, their goal has been to see the destruction of Israel as a safe-haven for the Jews.

Recently, a U.N. school was hit killing 40 people. However, in response Prime Minister Ehud Olmert authorized humanitarian aide to be delivered into the Gaza region. I think this shows Israel's humanity and dignity. A mistake was made, but an effort to recoup from that mistake was also made.

A report published in December 2007, stated that since 2001, 2,383 rocket attacks have hit inside Israeli land. The escalation of the rocket attacks on Israeli soil has caused an issue with their national security, infrastructure, and operations.

Quite simply, we are talking about the defense of a nation. Efforts immediately prior to these attacks were being made to relinquish some of the land acquired in the 1967 War (6-Day War) of Israel. Prime Minister Ehud Olmert said in September of this last year:

"We have to reach an agreement with the Palestinians, the meaning of which is that in practice we will withdraw from almost all the territories..."

Hamas, instead of embracing one of the greatest opportunities set out before them, has quite literally blown it away at this point.

I think that the U.S. should explore putting diplomatic restrictions on Russia, for under-the-table support of these groups through arms sales. Also, sanctions against countries like Syria and Iran, not only benefit Israel, but the United States as well. As there is an increasing threat developing from Iran, actions taken early on that restrict our trade or cooperation with them could be beneficial in the event that the United States would shift over from Iraq, using it as a spring-board, to attack neighboring Iran. I use the allusion of spring-board, from an idea from WWII, that Nazi Germany would use England as a "spring-board" to attack America. In the same sense, I think that Iraq can be used as a strategic site to maintain solidarity for the United States' interest within the Middle East.

At the end of all of my banter, there are simple ideas behind it all. First and foremost, nations and their governments first and sole responsibility is to protect their citizens and nation. Second, they are to secure their interests above the interests of others. The American's way of life is dependent upon this concept. I enjoy my luxurious, capitalistic, democratic lifestyle. Third, kill or be killed. The ideas of preemptive strikes have evolved since the Carthaginians and Romans through the implementation of Economic Warfare, and it's evolution since WWII. The use of diplomatic sanctions and economic leverage can be used to divert wars before they happen. If these tactics fail, then the Machiavellian saying from the Prince, of to rule "by arms or by fortune," still prevails to this day and age. There is a time that in order to insure the sovereignty of your nation, you must resort to arms.

RANDRIAMAMPIONONA S.
|
Madagascar
January 7, 2009

Solomon in Madagascar writes:

Mr president and commadeur of the all defence in usa and peole american. and secretary of state.gov defence Happy new Year Mr president and secretary and all people usa.

To be us corespondence and the petagone have sabotage and gafe. we need confurme you and your family and secretary rice on security renforcement us force special. confurme and renforcement the us all troup in all country we iself and defend on armement and soldier. When us peaces we already build and realize for waranty security defence us people jewish and America and the all acompany of us in the world ,we need stoping us war in palestin and use for excecution us respect and accept us peaces world for protect the democracy and right of man and we need change us position and orientation for finish us work war on terrorism and deliver the us peaces in the world ,but we never quiter us army in all coutry iself and defend.

Mr president us war not finish ,and there is very hard, because the leader and chief the all action terrorism in the world and he mersenary and he millis and he acompany never arest and iself and destroy ,we need prepare the next high war use for we finish us work and building the Peaces and democracy a long time ago in the world I wait your help and suport for, realize my traveling for us all project and us new high strategy of war US009. I'm already send message for give my advise high precition on against the problem of food and economic in the world on U.S FOOD in Healt Army. Thank very much The God Israel us protege.

Zharkov
|
United States
January 7, 2009

Zharkov in U.S.A. writes:

The way to get peace with Palestinians is to buy their land in a civilized manner.

There is no country on earth where a government or group of governments can forcibly take land away from people without starting a fight, unless they buy the land from them.

Purchase is what should have been done in 1948.

Presently, the Israeli nation is a "tenant by force of arms", courtesy of the United Nations and Britain, and the best way to convert its tenancy to ownership is to buy the land from the previous owners. Not all of Palestine was owned, but the lands that were owned certainly entitle the prior owners to compensation for that loss.

Jordan
|
South Dakota, USA
January 7, 2009

Jordan in South Dakota writes:

To answer the question directly, I believe we have several ways of approaching the issue at hand.

First, I believe that the United States and Russia should hold each other accountable for small arms sales, just like they hold each other accountable, sort of, with nuclear arms. Given our two nations seem to sell to every man, woman, and child in the world; I think we may have contributed to some of these problems. Second, I think we should conduct propaganda operations in the Middle East. Where did our propaganda machine from WWII go? If you win the minds of the people, you win. This is a war more about ideology and beliefs than of anything else. Third, I think the final blow will come through economic warfare organized to attack the machinations of specific terrorist organizations. I think President Reagan may have had some worthwhile thoughts on this matter that were applied to Communism, another ideology that we fought and overcame.

Also, given this another form of asymmetric warfare, I think we should reference T.E. Lawrence and some of his thoughts and experiences on the matter.

Those that don't know history, are doomed to repeat it.

joe
|
Tennessee, USA
January 7, 2009

Joe in Tennessee writes:

Quote:Well first its nice to meet you, but from ATL, GA it looks like the Palestian people have adopted the ideology of our founding fathers of liberty or death. If the Palestinians are prisoners in their own country, and can't elect their own government, or participate in their own governance how are they free? If their children are killed with no one being brought to justice are they free? END QUOTE

1. It is NOT THE PALISTINIAN peoples, it is a minority which has been politically undermined by everyone from Russia to Syria and Iran who have created fed this problem and in no way reflects all the Palestine peoples.

2. Hamas has OPENLY STATED: We will use our children and families to hide under .etc. Israel has been dropping leaflets asking the innocent to leave the area?and in the streets the Hamas snipers are using children walking across streets to hide behind and take their shots at Israeli troops. It is evil creating more evil for empowerment.

3. It is a Ghetto situation; but, on an International and National level. Palestine has had no realistic Governing force at any given time in recent history. There has always been internationalist cultural conflict within their social sphere, none of which are premised on a continuity for development and peace between each other much less with Israel. All the recent gains have been ruined by this one terroristic group which are no better than any Gang-bangers in a ghetto.

5. You misunderstood my Canadian reference...certainly we would not, that was the point.

You need to see the bigger picture in all this and that President Bush was right all along, this is all part of a larger plan by a colective group who are in fact EVIL...

Today alone, as someone mentioned Iran: Turkey holds suspicious Iran-Venezuela shipment
By SELCAN HACAOGLU
Associated Press Writer

ANKARA, Turkey -- Turkey was holding a suspicious shipment bound for Venezuela from Iran because it contained lab equipment capable of producing explosives, a customs official said Tuesday.

Suleyman Tosun, a customs official at the Mediterranean port of Mersin, said military experts were asked to examine the material, which was seized last month, and decide whether to let the shipment to go to Venezuela.

Authorities detected the equipment during a search of 22 containers labeled "tractor parts," Tosun said. They were brought to Mersin by trucks from neighboring Iran, he said. Turkey's Interior Ministry said an investigation was under way.

"Experts from Turkey's Atomic Institute determined there were no traces of radioactive material, but said the equipment was enough to set up an explosives lab," Tosun said. "We have asked the military to send experts to determine whether to resume the shipment."

Some barrels, labeled with "danger" signs, contained chemicals. Tosun said details were still unclear. An Iranian embassy official, speaking on condition of anonymity because he was not authorized to speak to the media, said the shipment contained "nothing important."

Iran and Venezuela operate various joint ventures in Venezuela, including plants to assemble tractors and cars. The two countries also have agreed to team up on petrochemical projects.

This is not meant as any political representation: but, as the cards are playing out at the end of President Bushs term, all he stated from the start of the war is unfolding in front of a Free Press which seems to refuse seeing things as they actually are... what Truths are being seeded by them? Only sensationalism premised on pity for each separate story to sell and maintain interest, nothing that shows the entire conflict as it exist in totality or how it is in effect part of a larger problem with other players.

Without realizing the total effect of the combined efforts of these underlying countries who support and create conflict through small ideological groups and eliminating that problem, there will be more Gaza type conflicts throughout the world...and more stories and pictures to sell.

joe
|
Tennessee, USA
January 7, 2009

Joe in Tennessee writes:

For those more experienced in the use of misinformation and Propaganda:

If you think that only one group is represented, simply look at the overall Propaganda as it is unfolding out of this conflict..this is not the result of a small Al-Qaida mind set. It is already putting the next administration up on the block ... :

Posted by: kdriggers on Jan 07 - 12:42

Al-Qaida's No. 2 leader lashed out at President-elect Barack Obama in a new audio message Tuesday, accusing him of not doing anything to stop Israel's offensive in the Gaza Strip, according to an intelligence monitoring center.

...and if you do not see this for what it is: empowerment through lies or evil empowering itself; because, this is not a truth statement at all and the average terrorist, even an educated one, would not have the capacity to string the use of the press in this manner.

It is part of a long range objective to enhance power as a collective; thus, providing more leverage for either group. This is old time, professional undertaking people...

When?

USperson
|
Minnesota, USA
January 8, 2009

USP in Minnesota writes:

Ladies and Gentlemen, Please, enough with the elementary blame-game. This is not 1948. The fact of the matter is: Palestine is now Israel. Like or dislike; this is reality. We are referring to an Internationally recognized, Sovereign Nation. Not some cracker-jack, "pro democracy", McLean Masterpiece, rising from the ashes of internal conflict.

Israel is legitimate. They are NOT going anywhere. They will NOT be "defeated." They are on the map until the ENTIRE slate is wiped clean. These FACTS may not comfort everyone, but they are FACTS. Hamas KNOWS they are INCAPABLE of waging war with The State of Israel. The unbalance of the pendulum is FLAGRANT. Yet they continue to display "militant" aggression. Why?

Well, after boiling all complexities away, it really comes down to PRIDE. Sift a little WRATH in there, along with a tinge of "Divine Justice" and a dose of Judgmental Indoctrination and you have your self a fresh concoction of HATE. Plain and simple. {an argument can also be made for ENVY.

Many Palestinian People are filled with HATE towards ALL JEWISH people... NOT JUST THE ISRAELIS... Similar are the sentiments of numerous Arabic Tribes of Islamic Doctrine. Not all. But numerous. The source can probably be attributed to the feudal, childish, arguments made by some shallow minded individuals, concerning which, of Abraham's seed... grew into Gods chosen people. Many Muslims believe the Jews are a fallen tribe, no longer worthy of Gods Grace.

Many Israelites, on the other hand, believe, obviously, that they TRULY are favored in the eyes of the All-Mighty. This belief also establishes a foundation of PRIDE. The Israelis ARE a PROUD bunch. Indisputable. In there eyes; they DESERVE that land. It was ALWAYS theres. Though never before have they been capable of defending it... UNTIL NOW.

To many Jews it is TRULY believed that this land is SACRED. Forever it has been stolen from them. Many Tribes and Creeds have played the role of "thief." Terrorists are just the current adversary. Many Jews have nothing personal against the Palestinians or any Muslims for that matter. They truly believe in there right to have a sanctuary. Which is understandable...and agreeable.

...But they are still PROUD. Too PROUD to set the Palestinian People back on there feet. To PROUD to humble themselves a bit to display LOVE and MERCY on the desolate and unfortunate HUMANS who are unlike them...of another creed, a separate doctrine. It is no secret that Many Jews hold a clinically psychological superiority complex. Not All...But Many. This entails them to TRULY believe that they are better than Palestinians, or any one else for that matter. They TRULY believe in ENTITLEMENT. This is evident. This WILL NOT change. Above Statements are Cultural, Anthropological, FACTS. It is not my intention to pass judgment; Only to RECOGNIZE and INFORM.

As far as Sustainable Peace in the Middle East is concerned. NOT GOING TO HAPPEN WITH PRIDE, HATE, and ENTITLEMENT at the fore front of the equation. Israeli Defense Forces have mobilized and attacked. Point of no return. They MUST NOT STOP UNTIL THEIR ENTIRE MISSION IS ACCOMPLISHED! There can be no "seize fire" until Hamas is imprisoned or, I hate to say it, . . .

Israel has the intelligence and operational resources to cripple this faction. Once done, the State of Israel needs to either financially set the Palestinians Up For Life {they are capable of this} and help them to relocate East of Israel [hey, how about prime land in IRAQ, hmmm...} thus Displaying HUMILITY, LOVE and MERCY. Help win the hearts and minds of the entire world! OR, Go into Gaza, Nation Build them a respectable infrastructure, and TRADE with them.
Or maintain the self-righteous status quo... and be prepared to reap-the-whirlwind.

Gentleman, it has truly been a pleasure. -- us person

carol
|
Canada
January 12, 2009

Carol in Canada writes:

I am sicken by people's attitude when it comes to indigneous people. Look at what the canadians made my people become and look at what they continue to do. Your govenment spoke in front of the whole world to try clean his conscience of what the government and church did to my people. The policies of genocide and these have been implemented world wide to our indigenous people. We have won the white war, but they don't want to give up , that is why they continue to try kill us all off. They know who has inherent right to protect this land and it's people. We all know why canada and israel are together, because they have the same policies they hide behind. These policies of genocide protect them and does nothing for us. Israel will not stop just with the palestinians. When they were dealing with the Nazi, no one stepped in to help them. So when they accomplish what they want from GAZA.....do you think they will stop there? NO! how i know this, i am an indigneous woman and i live and see what is being done to our land, our traditional territories,our medicines, our wildlife, our water , our children, our women and our men. And they are not stopping and no one is helping because they are to afraid to speak out about the injustice, but people are slowly waking up and soon, everything will change, including the attitude of society against our indigneous people.Take a good look at the pictures that are being broadcast.....what pictures do you see...i see a nation being slaughtered in front of the whole worlds eye and all you can talk about is israel. Lets get the story correct. A nation is being murdered and killed and no one is saying anything...of course you will blame the palestinians. Yes they have pride because they are palestinians, the first people of this land. The abuser is always trying to direct the attention elsewhere because they don't want to admit what they are doing is wrong. The abuser is always directing the attention to those who are getting hit the hardest, such as the first people of this occupied land they call CAnada. Now tell me what i am saying is not true. Did you become outrage when the government got up and admit to the whole world that they and the churches, sexually abuse, violated and raped, murdered and sodamized first native children. Did you become upset when all our native women died and went missing and they found them at a farm where they were murdered , slaughtered and killed. NO, and your still making excuses for a country that canada is standing with, and watching as innocent people are being slaughtered and murdered. No your making excuses, and of course as an individual, what rights do you have. You've educated yourself on fabricated, biases stories and the history is most likely not even correct. I know canada's history is incorrect. Look at the history of the first people before you make any judgement on our indigenous people around the world. Look at what canada is doing to the fist people of this land. Educate yourself before you make a bias opinion. The palestinians already won the war, they have the inherent rights to what is theirs to protect. But isreal is not ready to accept this, nor is canada, that is why they continue to do what ever they can against the first people of this stolen and occupied land. Educate yourselves before you make judgement. Your on stolen and occupied native land if your in this place called 'Canada".

Susan
|
Florida, USA
January 8, 2009

Susan in Florida writes:

To understand the situation in Israel is to understand the history of the Jewish people. Perhaps they were not so determined to have their own nation before World War II and Hitler. Many German Jews lost their lives because they could NOT believe that their country would betray them and kill them. They saw themselves as Germans first and believed in their fellow citizens and in their government. What we see today is a people who are no more prideful or arrogant than any other nationality. What is going on in the Middle East is a fight for survival. Israel was "created" in 1948 as a response to the systematic extermination of the Jews. Please, if you ever get a chance to visit one of the Holocaust Museums, do go. There are only two in the world, one in Israel and one here in the U.S., in Washington, D.C.. See why the motto of the Jewish people today is "Never again". This is not "pride", it is, rather, self-preservation.

Victor
|
Washington, USA
January 8, 2009

Victor in Washington writes:

Cutting through the smoke, mirrors and myriad of details, there is one answer to all our planets social problems. From environmental to governmental. Just like in our american society, unless you can show self defense, you should not have the right or the power to attack another. If you wish to do so, you must use the law to acquire the right. World law is attainable. And a world court is what we must use to agress another nation. You make your case, it goes to vote and majority rules. By the nations for the nations. There has never been in the history of mankind a united nations. Those two words being used together insults the intelligent. There is a way there however. Do not be diverted by appearances and work hard to see how butt naked the emperor is. America will lead due to its diversity of citizenry and our recent historical struggle for civil rights. We have credibility. we are a white nation with a black leader. Which direction we steer the ship is the question. Comes with our status responsibility. I can not write slowly, I have not the room or the time. You must use your mind. Technology wields a double edge. It cares not and it will not slow down. There is only one real common interest and humans are part of that interest. Humans are as environmental as the air and water. Listen closely to our leaders, search hard for the right one, and hope they have the how to we as an environment need. When the fire burns your butt, you will learn who is responsible. Listen and watch closely, do your part, use your vote wisely. I promise you from one brother to another that a united nations can be built and peace on earth is possible. And I ain't no liberal. It is not overwhelmingly impossible as most believe. Bruce Lee was probably the most physically accomplished we in the west know of, and his most profound quote was "the most difficult aspect in the development of martial arts is being honest". The more of us that make the broader connections and get out of the forest of minutia, the greater our odds of accomplishing the only real goal in front of us today, that being to simply survive.

Doyle
|
West Virginia, USA
January 9, 2009

Doyle in West Virginia writes:

1) Do not blame the Israelis. It is no different than someone setting up missle and mortar bases in Dallas and started shooting into Fort Worth. Or if someone started lobbing missles across the border from Mexico or Canada. Wait long enough and we will want to attack. Well Israel has faced such attacks since their re-birth in 1948.

2) There are no such things as Palestinians. They are now, and have always been, Arabs. Bleeding hearts in Hollywood, DC, and around the world aren't going to change that, no matter how many times they tell the lie. Palestine was a fiction created by map makers to erase the existence of Israel. Read your history and see for yourselves. And to top it off, Palestine was a version of the word Philistine.

3) Ever notice how the media focuses on "Palestinian" wounded but you hardly ever hear about the people who are killed/wounded in terrorists attacks in Israel. Why? Because the media is afraid of Islamic terrorists (not the lie of militants, but the truth of terrorists) strapping on a bomb and paying them a visit.

4) My last point, if the world wants peace in the Middle East, disarm the Islamic countries, file charges against the government of Russia for arming and supporting Islamic terrorists in the world courts with all fines to be paid to the families of terror victims, and support Israel. Let them do the job of protecting their people, without anyone (including Rice, Bush, Obama) saying one word. Israel is a sovreign nation, with full rights to protect its citizens, from all attacks, foreign and domestic.

Joe
|
Tennessee, USA
January 9, 2009

Joe in Tennessee writes:

1. Here are quotes from the leadership of Hamas: Hamas Cleric Muhsen Abu Ita: "The Annihilation of the Jews in Palestine Is the Most Splendid Blessing for Palestine"; March 25, 2008
Islamic cleric on the Jews: "As Muslims, our blood vengeance against them will only subside with their annihilation"

A sermon last Friday by a prominent Muslim cleric and Hamas member of the Palestinian parliament openly declared that "the capital of the Catholics, or the Crusader capital," would soon be conquered by Islam. Now you tell me how you can deal with such hatred of not one, but two religions and all democratic ideology?

Hamas is a threat to the entire stabilization of world peace -- there is no middle ground with them until the reality of death and the free world intervenes, then they simply start over. We should be helping Israel with troops for elimination.

2. Why is there not a concerted effort to CLOSE the tunnels from the Egyptian side? Would that not aid in lowering the threat to Israel? Talk accomplished nothing when Hamas simply kept sending missiles. Do you actually think that Hezbollah was NOT INVOLVED yesterday, or that there is not a group of Hamas residing in Lebanon? You cannot simply shoot off a rocket like a roman candle and you cannot purchase them like firecrackers.

3. The State of Israel has simply had enough and it has been a long time coming. The Free world should have had enough by now and not sent Hamas a cent unless they were willing to comply to peace totally.

The innocent only suffer when they do not stand together and even in this case, have had more than ample time to move out of harms way.

USperson
|
Minnesota, USA
January 12, 2009

USP in Minnesota writes:

My fellow citizens, Please, lets be realistic and put our heads together. First however, allow us to RECOGNIZE, an indisputable fact: There are ONE BILLION MUSLIMS. The "equation" includes more than the Palestinians. More than the "real estate" in question. More than a concrete issue. The problem before us, stems from a psychological seed, planted deep within the brain of many Arab people, as well as, lets be HONEST, many non-Arab people, of all walks of life. The SEED planted in these minds is HATE / ENVY. For whatever reason, from whatever source, it exists. In the case at hand, these emotions are directed towards the Jewish People at large. These two emotions are tragic. They are also REAL. RECOGNIZE.

Since we are all in agreement that these emotions drive humans to become very angry, we are also all in agreement that anger breeds violence. That said, we find ourselves in a fight. One that doesn't start or end with the Middle East. One that starts and ends with EMOTION. UNDERSTAND.

We can not "defeat" ONE BILLION angry humans. RECOGNIZE that we will not nuke any one because are force is not driven by hate, envy, anger, etc. Our energy is driven by Defense, Preservation, Advancement. We will not try to obliterate anyone. . . But they will.

They will because Anger is driving there mind, body, and soul. They HATE. They ENVY. UNDERSTAND.

Yes, some of us have also been consumed with these self destrustive characteristics as well, unfortunately. . . but the guy that, literally, presses the button that starts the FINAL WAR, is NOT filled with any SELF DESTRUCTIVE EMOTIONS. HE IS SOUND. He knows the implications and ramifications of his actions. He is not driven by anger.

But the next nuclear power obviously is. This is SERIOUS.

The only advise I can offer is to extend an olive branch. The HATE and ENVY and ANGER must be exstinguished in our FELLOW HUMANS. STOP calling them adversaries. Change the WHOLE approach. WE WILL NOT DESTROY THE ENTIRE PLANET AND 99.9% OF ITS OCCUPANTS. We will swallow OUR PRIDE and PLAY PSYCHOLOGIST. PEACE. NOT VICTORY.

TIGHTEN UP & SUCK IT UP my BROTHERS...Or be prepared to reap the whirl-wind.

Gentleman, it has truly been a pleasure -- USperson

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